SPEAKER_01 0:33

Welcome to the Better Two Podcast. I'm your host, Donna. Today's guest is Margaret Jervich. Margaret has a brand new book out called Yashi's Amazing Bar Mitzva. And we talk about the book, we talk about her writing career. We also talk about her being a teacher, her favorite shows to watch, her cat named Goosey, and well, so much more. So tune in. Hi Margaret, how are you doing today?

SPEAKER_00 0:57

I'm good. Thank you for having me. How are you?

SPEAKER_01 1:00

I'm good. I am very good. You um you're a teacher. I was surprised by that, but it it kind of made sense when I was looking at your background about the book you wrote because he's going through his teenage years and you also have a son. So I was gonna ask you, kind of have you know, because you're a woman and you're writing about a teenage boy going through his bar mitzvah. Um, how was that for you as far as you know, did you take stuff from your own personal stuff, personal life as far as your experience growing up and then meld it with the people that you've dealt with, the students, the your son. Did you take all of those experiences and make it one experience to write this book?

SPEAKER_00 1:42

Yeah, so I actually um I kind of think Yasha is very much me as a teenager, except as a boy. Um so because my son, um, well, he's 18 now, but uh he didn't have to deal with a lot of that stuff. And also, um, because there's a lot of things in in the book, it's about um trying to be comfortable with who you are, and he's one of the first Russian, one of the few um Russian kids, Russian families in the town. And it's funny, it's based on the town that I grew up in, but we were like one of the first, like few first five Russian families here, maybe. And now there's so many um people who are, and whenever I tell people one of the first, they're shocked. So Yasha's experience, he's a little bit older because in 1986 I was 10, he's 13, but a lot of the things he experiences are things that I experience. So had I been a boy, I think that that's what I think that's um what it would have been. And in terms of the, I feel like I do have the boy voice down, and I think that's because I have a son, I have, you know, I I teach middle school. Um, so I feel I did I did a pretty good job with that. But yes, I feel like he's kind of based a lot on me and it's a story I wanted to tell.

SPEAKER_01 2:59

So makes sense. And I mean, like you said, you did take a little bit from the others, and and that's you know, that's the thing. When especially like you said it in 1986, I'm a I'm an author myself. Most of my books are set in the 80s and 90s. And as you said, your son didn't have to experience certain things. And that's the truth because the the younger generations, they know don't know what it's like not to have a cell phone, they don't know what it's like to have, you know, not have a computer, where every you know, card catalog was our friend. Those things. I mean, it it's the the difference in those little minute things. Somebody was telling me they had read one of my books recently, and they're like, why didn't she just text him? I'm like, because it's the early 90s. We didn't do those things. Yeah, so did you did you find it difficult to write back into that time frame, or was it very simple because you experienced it?

SPEAKER_00 3:50

Um, somewhere in the middle, because there's a lot of things I experienced that I was able to put in. But then a part of me, like when I was reading, I was more just being afraid that accidentally put in stuff from 2025, as opposed to, you know, having it like they like the cell phone thing, right? So I'd be writing and I'd be like, oh no, no, they can't text. They don't do that. So um, so but I really liked that they couldn't because all these things that could have just been solved, you know, through a tech, that was not the case, right? And you had to actually go to people's houses and talk, and you couldn't catch an Uber somewhere, and you had to figure out if you were gonna be biking somewhere, or so different little things, or and even like the money situation, you can't just be like I have Apple Pay, right? So I really like that. Um, I love writing by the 80s and 90s as well, because uh you don't have to include a lot of the stuff from now. And it's actually funny because when I write about this time period, I have to make sure I do click. Obviously, I do text and everything, but when I think about characters, I just want them to be. But then I and but when you're writing about teenagers and even adults, I guess for that matter, you have to go back and be like, well, wouldn't they just text? Wouldn't they just figure it out like that? So it's kind of nice that I didn't even have to deal with that.

SPEAKER_01 5:16

Right. Yeah, I mean, I and I totally understand. I was having a conversation with somebody from England uh not too long ago, and somehow we got into the subject of layaway, and he didn't understand what layaway was because they don't have it over there. Oh, and I'm like, and of course we don't really have it now, but I mean that back in the 80s and 90s, that was like, okay, I'm gonna go to work, I'm gonna pay for my stuff, I'm gonna put my clothes on layway. Mom can't tell me what I'm wearing because I'm buying these. So you put them on layway and you pay for it. And those things don't happen now. It's like everything is instant gratification, where before you had to wait. And I think that's one of the reasons why because we have the cell phone number, and all we have to do is click a person's name. We used to know how many phone numbers.

SPEAKER_00 5:59

Mm-hmm. I still remember um some of my childhood friends. We may not be friends anymore, but I remember their phone numbers still.

SPEAKER_01 6:06

Wow.

SPEAKER_00 6:07

So I know my my head has useless information.

SPEAKER_01 6:10

I think we all do. And not to I I kind of understand where you're coming from as far as being the first Russian family, because I was my my parents split in the 70s, and divorce had not been really big yet. So I was one of those weird kids that came from a divorced home. So it was kind of like you don't fit in because nobody knows how to react, that you're different and you're not the norm. So therefore, you have to, I don't want to say acclimate, but you learn how to navigate.

SPEAKER_00 6:44

Yes, yes, very true. Yeah. Um, and I think too, um, like in my book in your situation, when people don't know what to say, they also lean towards saying the completely wrong, inappropriate thing. So um, and then it also I think makes you a target sometimes too. Because if you're different, obviously that's an easy point to pick on. And if somebody wants to say something, they know what to say, that would be upsetting.

SPEAKER_01 7:13

Oh, yeah. So yeah, definitely. And kids, let's be honest, and I know you're a teacher, kids can be really mean when they want to be.

SPEAKER_00 7:22

Yeah, yes, that is true. Um, and I guess some adults too, but don't grow up, but yeah, but yes, for sure. I think especially the middle school years, especially because people are navigating their own situations and a lot of times lash out at other people because of their own insecurities and things that they're dealing with. So, yes, for sure.

SPEAKER_01 7:43

What made you decide to become a teacher?

SPEAKER_00 7:46

Um, I always enjoyed working with kids. Like I used to be a camp counselor and things like that. And then I um was always loved English. So I felt those two would marry each other. Like it'll be a good um, it'll be a thing that will work out well. Um, I also though like I really love um doing private lessons too with people to help them with writing and creative writing. And um, my friend and I actually recently just started a college coaching business as well, where we help kids with their essays and um making college application lists. So I guess anything where I feel I'm helping students is right up right up my alley. And that's why I think I write books for this age group.

SPEAKER_01 8:33

So um as a teacher and even working with the college students, how do you navigate the AI situation?

SPEAKER_00 8:42

Oh yeah. So I mean, at the middle school level, I have sixth graders, so it's not they still feel like if you tell them that's not what we're doing, they they will listen, like they don't want to do that. But um I mean, when we do the essays with uh the soon-to-be college students, we working together, we you know, imprint on them that a lot of colleges, you know, could tell. And I think the fear of being caught, especially like because if you want to go into higher, you know, higher learning and and you want to go into college, you don't want to be caught with that, you know, situation. So, so they are good about that. But, you know, they have been um some instances, and I feel like one of the things that I think students are starting to understand, like at all the ages, is that AI, like it could be a tool to help, but AI, the amount of information you have to feed it so that it does exactly what you want it to do, you may as well just write it yourself at that point. Because you could tell a lot of times when they run it through AI, because the things that AI gives back is not at all what we've covered in class. So they could have all this information, but it's not related. So um, you know, I I guess because I grew up in the 80s and 90s, I'm trying to, I guess like I'm all that way. I'm trying to come to terms with that. Like I feel there's an AI could be a helper, right? Like it could be a starting point. You could be like, you know, I love sports, help me generate five topics that would be great to write about. Okay, but then from there, you should go and do your own thing. Okay, because having your own voice is so important. Um so yeah, so I think when I work with students, we talk about that. That it's you know, a lot of times we keep telling them they're smarter than AI because uh they put their own spin on the things they have to write about. Like AI knows so much. Um, like I even compare it to pictures. Like sometimes we'll take like images, you know, AI generated images, and you could tell a lot of the times which are the AR-generated images because they're just off, right? And that's what it is. I feel like I tell them, you know, sometimes their writing is just off. And I've done like in some cases, I'd be like, This is yours. This is a yeah, I like yours better. It's not, you know, so I think that's I wouldn't say it's completely ah, you know, it's definitely like a learning tool, but I think it's important that um kids and teens, you know, uh know that they could put a lot of themselves into a piece that AI just can't do, right? And you want to make sure it's the work that you would be proud of and you want to produce.

SPEAKER_01 11:37

So it's kind of funny because there's times when um I'll say something on social media that talks about the fact that this is AI, and it's it's something like, oh, they ran their hand through their hair. It's like you have to realize that AI learned from other books, right? And I think that's the bigger thing. It's like, and and you want, and like you said, you want your own voice, and so many people, you know, I want to write a book, so I put everything in chat GPT and I wrote a book. No, you prompted, you did not actually, exactly.

SPEAKER_00 12:12

That's not the same, and you want yours to sound different, and if everyone puts their work through chat GPT, eventually it's just gonna sound the same.

SPEAKER_01 12:21

Yeah, so you also like hiking and binging TV. So, what kind of TV shows do you like to watch?

SPEAKER_00 12:28

Oh my goodness, so many and too many. I um I like a lot of like there's some mysteries that we like, like murders in the building, high potential is a new one that we like. High potential's good. I love that. Um, so I like like smart TV, but I also love like also smart TV about relationships. Like I love shrinking. Um I like back in the day, there was like Gilmore girls. I was into that, Dawson's Creek. I grew up with all those Beverly Huslano 2-0, like all that stuff. I feel like TV is like different now, but um, we just got into the pit, and I love that so much. I feel what it does, like like if you want to talk about character development, because you're taking one, so each season is one day, and when you're looking at it per hour, and they so you meet this character at the start, and then you see them at the end, and they did all these things to create um this whole all these emotions and personality character, but you're like, Oh, it's only been one day that we're seeing them. Okay, it's really smart. So um, so many, so, so many things. Like, I I could go on forever. I'm trying to think what else, but then that's all we'd end up talking about.

SPEAKER_01 13:46

Well, you're you also have a cat named Goosey, and I'd like to know why did you name the cat Goosey?

SPEAKER_00 13:50

So it wasn't me. Um, when we got him, it was 2020, and our son was in sixth grade, and um, there's an Avengers movie at the time, and there's um a cat that looks exactly like ours. Um, but it's not really a cat. He's called like a Florkin, so he's kind of like an alien. So when my son saw him, he's like, that's who and in um, so he named him goose because in the in Avengers that was his name. So hence, so he looks like the Florkin, but it's like, yeah, and we call him goosey because that's his well affectionate name.

SPEAKER_01 14:26

I was gonna say, every animal you have, they start out with one name and they end up with five. Yes, and they respond to all of them, so yeah. So I had to ask also about your book. You talk about Bernie. Was there really a Bernie in your life that you wanted to hang out with that you kind of saw saw as a mentor?

SPEAKER_00 14:44

So there wasn't in that sense, because this is a man he meets at like the senior center and they bond. And but I was very, very close to my grandparents, and um, I feel like they helped raise me. So um to me, like this connection he has with Bernie is very much like a connection I had with my grandfather and my grandmother, and granted, it wasn't the exact same relationship, but um just the things they do together, like playing cards and just speaking and somebody who understands them. I always felt like that about my grandparents. Like, you know, people talk about if you would ever go back in time. So if I would ever go back in time, it would be to like a time when they were still alive because they're they're just so influential in my life.

SPEAKER_01 15:27

So I think a lot of us grew up playing cards with our grandparents. My grandmother and I would have uh hot oval teen, and she had this copper cookie tin that had I don't know how many different cookies in it for whatever flavor. And then we'd play rummy, we'd play rummy, and Carson would be on in the background because you're supposed to be in bed by now, but it's the summer and she's letting you stay up. Okay, and giving you chocolate and cookies before bed. Let's think about that.

SPEAKER_00 15:54

I know my grandmother was the same way. My grandmother says, funny, my grandfather knew English and actually lots of different languages. Um, and he was a teacher when he was in the former Soviet Union. Uh, my grandmother did not know English, but she would watch a lot of these shows from and then she would like she watched Brady Bunch or um she liked Webster, she liked uh different strokes. There's a whole bunch that she watched. Oh, Little House in the Prairie. So we would watch that and and play cards or like dominoes, and she would have her own, you know, way to like she'd because there's so much physical uh stuff going on and these and physical humor, she was able to understand all of those. So um yeah, Yasha and Bernie don't watch that. Their thing is sports, but my grandma and I also like bonded on like different, you know, TV. She'd be like, Oh, let's watch that show with the six kids, which was Brady Bunch, you know, or she'd be like, Oh, I remember like it's called the Little House.

SPEAKER_01 16:45

So like she she would uh How many how many languages do you speak?

SPEAKER_00 16:51

I just speak too fluently, so English and Russian are the only two. I know snippets of other things, but not fluently. So um I can't read and well, I could read and write in Russian, but like very, very elementary level, like not even because I didn't finish I I we came to the States when I was three years old. So I taught myself kind of to read and write in Russian, but it's so it's like very uh minimal. I've been trying to teach myself to fluently read um in Russian, but I don't haven't had the time. Um but I speak it and I understand it. So um yeah, in English, obviously.

SPEAKER_01 17:28

Did your parents both speak Russian? I'm assuming they both did in and English as well.

SPEAKER_00 17:33

Yeah, and now because we've lived here for so long, so we came here in 1979. Um when there's they speak a lot of English now. I mean, they still speak Russian, but every conversation is like not solely in Russian, it's a combination of different English words. And my mother was still when she starts talking, she's like, Do you understand what I'm saying? I was like, I I I've known it for years. I don't really I don't speak it as much now, so I forget some words, but I but flu I understand it completely. And um, my son actually started taking Russian in college this year. He only did a semester, that's all I needed, but he has other classes. He may go back, he picked started picking up things pretty quickly, even though like at home we don't speak it because my husband doesn't know Russian, he knows like a few words here and there, um, because he hears us say it. But so yeah.

SPEAKER_01 18:21

That's always I went I had a friend in high school whose mom was from Italy. And I think the first couple of times I went over there, anytime she wanted to communicate with her daughter and she didn't want me to know or her husband to know, she'd start speaking Italian. And it's like, okay, what it what are you talking about? But you know, you don't know, and and being the person that can't speak it, you're just kind of like, mm-hmm. And a high school kid, yeah, you're definitely going, Did I do something wrong? Does she like me? Yeah. Um, but it was just a tone. Yeah, you don't know like what exactly. Exactly. If you if you could understand the inflection more, I'd be like, oh, okay, she she's cool. Yeah, but without the inflection and not understanding the inflection, nah, you don't know. You don't know. So how long have you been teaching?

SPEAKER_00 19:09

Um total, I think I'm trying to think. I think I'm on 12 years now because I taught for six years um out of college, then I left, and I um was writing full time, and then I had my son, and then I did not go back again until he was nine. So I guess nine plus okay, 15. 15 years total then.

SPEAKER_01 19:39

And then do you see a difference in the students from then to now?

SPEAKER_00 19:44

Yes, very much so. I think it's I mean, you're you have a lot of kids where like they miss some of the socialization opportunities and academic opportunities because of COVID. So I think there's still a little bit of that that we're dealing with, but also, you know, the big thing of the advance uh like of social media and how tied everybody is to that. So um I think everything is different in that respect too. So I try to do a lot of um activities that involve visualization and different visual components, not necessarily online. We're actually um kind of going back and trying to get offline for a lot of things with like with writing because of the A of the AI component that you're talking about, too. But also I think kids like sometimes when it's too much screen time, like it's a lot for them, right? And a lot of times when we do things on paper, be drawing or writing, they get happy and they say, oh, good. And they'll close their Chromebooks and it's like a break, and they feel it's different. So I think I think while I see a difference, I'm hoping eventually like it might go start going back a little bit to what it was when people see that not everything has to be computers. It's a good way to like blend the two things. I mean, computers are great, there's so many things. We do plenty online as well, but it's nice for them to be able, like when you do things by hand or color, it's a different part of your brain that's working. And you understand material better. There'll be all these studies when you like handwrite it. So I think all those things like are important as well. So we'll see where things go in the next few years. Um, I don't know, it's funny, everyone's talking about AI now, but who knows what it's gonna be later. And also, like back in the day, and I'm sure you remember this being that you're an author as well, that people were saying, like when people were starting to do e readers and stuff, people are like, Oh, that's it, no one's gonna buy real books anymore. And everybody was freaking out and saying that's it, that's the publishing world. And pe plenty of people buy real books. Like it's still a thing. We still have libraries, we still have bookstores. So I I don't know. I I don't think it's going to be as completely overrun, I feel, as people think, because there's still people that would want things kind of how it used to be. And I'm so glad we still have real books. I'll read it um on my phone, or I can know if I need to, if I'm traveling a lot and need to, but I really love to hold the book. And there's other people that feel that way too. So I feel the same thing kind of with other technology that who knows what's gonna happen.

SPEAKER_01 22:30

It's well, and the fact is a lot of people are are rebuking AI. They don't want it, they don't want it forced down their throat. And I think that's the bigger thing is you know, Amazon suddenly put an app into or a component into their Kindle app, which is Ask a Book. And authors unfortunately can't opt out, readers can't opt out, but it's basically it can summarize the book for you. Um if I wanted to buy the Cliff Notes version of a book, I would buy the Cliff Notes version.

SPEAKER_00 22:59

Exactly. Exactly.

SPEAKER_01 23:02

Um so what else? You said you were a full-time writing. I know you have one other book out. Is do you have more than one other book?

SPEAKER_00 23:09

So I I have um, so I write in the the new write on the Margaret Garvich, and I have a series called Chloe by Design that I wrote um a little while back, but people are still buying it, which is nice. Um, it's kind of like a project runway for kids. Um, I did a few books uh for the beginning called Um Penning Workshop Call, uh like from the Who Vo Who Was series as well. Um and then the book that came out last year was Ain't It Funny, which focuses on anxiety and um which is really needed, especially like when I was growing up, nobody talked about that. Um, people were afraid to say anything because that meant there was something wrong with you. And when I was younger, I had a lot of like issues with anxiety. I didn't know what it was. I thought I thought there was something, you know, wrong with me. Um and I read in some OCD and I and I read stuff now with all the explanation, like if you're experiencing this, this, and I was like, I was experiencing all that then. And I um so I feel it's nice, like I do feel people are more open about that now, which is great. And I think it'd be it's good for for students and kids to see that there's people like them and then there's not, that there's not run anything wrong with them, and then there's strategies that you could do. And she also does stand up to combat anxiety. And the best reviews for that book, like you like it, you don't like it, but most either way, like say that it's a real accurate portrayal of anxiety, and that makes me very happy because that's what because I've read, because I feel with mental health, um, it's it's difficult because even people who experience the same mental health issue, be it anxiety or CD in this case, um, if you don't experience it exactly like them, they think that it's inaccurate. And whereas really it's on a spectrum. So um I that's I was kind of trying to dispel that also because a lot of people think that, like, oh, you have anxiety, so you can't be around people. No, that's one form of anxiety, but there's so many others, like there's people that like I'm social, but I may be anxious about other things, right? And it's I feel like it's dangerous to put people in this box and then you're like discounting people's real life lived experiences. Um, so and the and Yasha, Yasha's amazing bar mitzvah, that's um coming out. Uh, with that one, I I also feel like I I guess my goals when I write is that people could see themselves in the books. And the struggle I feel with identity um in Yasha and who you are and learning to be happy with who you are, regardless of you know, people around you. Um, I think it's really important. Uh for so I focus on like being a hyphenated American because I feel like I'm Russian Jewish American. And all those things make me, but when I was growing up, like Yasha, I felt it was a real struggle because people only saw the Russian because it was like the 80s and you know, it's the whole Cold War and everything. Um, and then even people sometimes in my Hebrew school class didn't view me like the same because of the Russian component. And then even though we came to America and we were American, people didn't view that part of me. And then as I so I struggled, like, which is the bigger identity, what you know, and as I got older, I realized, no, you could be all these things, and you could bring elements of your culture into you know the United States and what you're doing. And now I see myself as all of it. But it took a really long time to get there, and that's what Yasha struggles with. And I think people living here also with more than one identity and different cultures. It's like sometimes I feel they think like, or they're made to feel rather that you're less of an American if you still want to keep elements of your culture, but you could have everything and still be American.

SPEAKER_01 27:22

So well, and we're supposed to be the great melting pot, you know. Right. And and the I've had my own experience because recently, uh earlier this week, I had gone to the YMCA, has a program called Cancer Strong. So anybody that's gone through cancer, you kind of have a rehabilitation program that they have that's offered for free that you can go and you're with other cancer survivors, men and women, all different cancers. And I went through a whole cancer journey last year, and close friends, one of them had cancer, but most of them didn't understand. Most of them don't understand what it's like. And the reason why I bring this up is it gets to a point as you whether you're an immigrant, whether you are from a divorced family, that from the moment you're a kid, as you start to age, you get a label placed upon you. And I often say it's like a book cover because here's this book cover of who you are, and I'm gonna look at you and say whether I like you or not. But the truth is you're you're missing the point because we look at book covers that way. We look at book covers and go, oh, that looks like a great book to read. And then you could be disappointed inside. But the fact is, most people will look at you and don't, they'll judge you by whatever label you have, how you look, and they might miss a great opportunity. And that's the one thing about the being in that group the other day. It's like, yeah, we all had cancer, but we all had a different experience because we all had different cancers. It wasn't everybody's here with breast cancer or everybody's here with this cancer, everybody's here with no, it we were all different, and we all found a unity to go there and and do this and commit to it. And I think that's the biggest thing is if we could get past these labels, we would be much better off as a society, but we have to have those labels. And I and I, for a long time, I lost my husband in 2020, and when I got divorced, I didn't mark divorced, I put single. I'm like, I'm single again. And so why do I have to put widow? Oh, it's on my tax papers, it's on everything that I have to be a widow. It's like, why? I love somebody. Yeah, he died. Why does it have to follow me around? Why does and it's not and when you get to heritage, I mean, I'm from New Orleans. As soon as I say I'm from New Orleans, oh, you must like to party. No, not really, never have, but okay, you can assume that. And that's the thing, it's like just accept me for who I am, don't label me.

SPEAKER_00 29:48

I love that, and I love that you compared it to a book cover too. I think that is such a great analogy. I haven't like really even thought of that. Um, right, because we decide do we want to be with somebody or be with the book, right? Just by looking at the outside, and we don't, you know, we don't know, and like with people, whether it's the accent or something else or where they're from, like you said, New Orleans. And um, people just want to assume, and I feel that goes too to the like people on their own, it's easier for them if they could compart compartmentalize and put people in boxes because it makes their life easier, right? But right, how much more beautiful would everything be if we could just find unity, even if we're, you know, everybody is different? Because everyone can learn from someone, you know, we could all learn from each other.

SPEAKER_01 30:37

So I mean, I've said it many a time about we go back to the Rodney King statement, can't we all just get along? And if we could, if we actually had we actually believed in humanity, in I in peace and love and not so much violence, and I want this, and I if we just took away the materialism and looked at humanity, we would be in a much better place overall.

SPEAKER_00 31:03

Yes, for sure, for sure. Um yeah, I feel too, and I feel like literature is a great place for that, right? Everyone could see themselves or find the human moments in what characters experience, right? Because few books have um characters for one dimensional. Everybody tries to make them because nobody's all good or all bad, you know. We've or like it makes me think of like, I feel they have less movies like that now, but um, back in the day, you know, we watched The Breakfast Club and all that, everybody was this like stereotype of one person, right? But there's so much more to people. Um, even today, we're talking about a book in class, and um, one of the characters in the book had mentioned that um nobody would want to be friends with him if he was really smart. And I asked my students, I said, Do you feel like that? And they thought that was the most ridiculous statement they've ever heard. They said, What do you mean? Why, why would I rather be smart than um than not? Why would they care if I was smart? And I was like, and I said to I said, Wow, this generation is really different. I said when I was growing up, it was such a label, and you'd be like nerdy, and people tried to hide who you know who they were, right? Um, intellectually. So I find that interesting. I think that like sometimes people now too, you know, try to hide who they are because they're afraid of what somebody else may say. And in Yasha's amazing bar mitzvah, but also he tried to hide who he was and his culture because he wanted to fit in.

SPEAKER_01 32:34

I hate to do this, but we got to start wrapping up. Is there anything that I haven't covered with you that you want to add?

SPEAKER_00 32:41

Um, I do want to refer people to my website. Oh, yeah. That's okay. It's um margirites.com. And you could get the book on Amazon, or if your local indie bookstore support, you know, small bookstores doesn't have it, please ask them to order it so that more people could see it. I think in the end, it's um just important that we see um little bits of each other. Oh, and one of the other big things, so a big subplot in this book is the 1986 Mets. Can't believe I almost left without mentioning that. So that was the last time they won the World Series. That was the time that I became a Mets fan. And that was a big time in '86. It's like everybody was a Mets fan. So um, shout out to all the Mets fans out there. And I think that this would be a great book to read. Maybe you have somebody in your life who's older and saw the 86 Mets. You guys could read it together with if you have a if you have a child, or even if you don't, it has universal themes that um people could connect to.

SPEAKER_01 33:40

Well, and a lot of adults read YA now, so yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 33:44

So um, yeah, it's accessible.

SPEAKER_01 33:47

Your website will be in the show notes, so check it out, guys. And thank you, Margaret, for coming on.

SPEAKER_00 33:53

Thank you so much. I appreciate it. Thank you for having me.

SPEAKER_01 33:56

Margaret and I had an interesting conversation, and I really could relate, it's not the exact same thing, but in the 70s, as I was saying, I was this kid who suddenly dad wasn't around all the time. And it was even more twisted than that because within a year after they split, I was living with the fifth-grade teacher. So I really didn't fit in. Um, but it was it was something I had to learn to navigate. I had to try to figure out how to fit into my own life, and I think that's a hard thing for most kids to do, is to figure out who we are normally. But then when you have other things like coming from a different country, you know, even when I moved from New Orleans to Shreveport and I was in my junior year, suddenly everybody talked like this. They had that twine, and I had more of a New York accent. Even though I was from New Orleans, everybody swore I was from New York. So I and I didn't say everything the same way. I mean, we had different words, and I've talked about that before in the podcast. You know, we had different words instead of a median, it's a neutral ground down there. So, you know, fitting in was awkward. But you try to navigate, you try to make the best of the situation and hope that you can find one or two people at least to be your friend. And I think that social awkwardness, if we don't know how to navigate, we don't know how to learn to navigate, it continues with us throughout our life, and we never really discuss it. But it's something that, you know, we try to focus, we try to make friends, we try to have the the faith that we're gonna continue on. And and we do we still can make lifelong friends, but there's always that uncertainty. There's always, did I say something wrong? Did I and that's anxiety? Anxiety will make you question, anxiety will make you wonder if I did the right thing, if I said the right thing. And we don't really name anxiety. I I didn't have my first panic attack until I was in my 40s, which seems crazy. But I think we all eventually can have one because we never really realize the stress we're under. And we've, you know, I've talked about that before about how the doctor said to me after the hubby died, do you realize all the stress you were under? No, because that was life. That was life. And so how do I recognize it if that is just life? And I think as we grow up, as we're, you know, as I said earlier, when we were first when we're that little kid, we don't have those labels. We don't have those those names yet. We don't, we haven't been picked on necessarily. But as soon as we start tacking on those things, it's like there's a commercial running around with somebody that has a bunch of sticky notes on them. There's two different, there's one with body armor and there's one with sticky notes. But if we could take each sticky note off of us, each one of those labels, think about how much lighter we would be. You know, we wouldn't be labeled, you know, the nerd, as she was saying, or the geek, or, you know, the pretty princess, however you want to call it, the loner. You know, if we could all just look past what what we see, you know, I'm looking at my hair now and I'm thinking, oh, I really hate it. At least when it was thin before, I didn't have to worry about the bald spot. But here's the thing: I have hair, I have hair again, I have eyebrows again, I have eyelashes again. I mean, if you go back to podcasts from this summer, you're gonna see me without any of that. And in fact, into the fall, because I didn't have that, but it came back. And is it perfect? No. Do I feel confident with the way I look? No. Am I accepting of it? Sure. Because I don't want to go around wearing a wig. It would have been perfect to wear a wig during the winter, but I don't want to do that. It's not me. So I think we really need to try to give people the benefit and try to come together. One of the biggest things about labeling, especially like right now, and I don't want to get political, but because we label each other, all these things, and I'm not saying that we shouldn't be ticked off because of the situation we are in in this world. But I think the problem is eventually things are gonna shake loose, and eventually we're all gonna have to come together and talk and figure all of this out and work to make it a better place. And we can't do that if we're divided. And in and who benefits by us being divided? If we're arguing and not paying attention to what's going on in the world, well, things can happen that we'll never gonna see until it's too late. So we need to try to come together and be supportive of one another. And if it's if somebody's done really crappy stuff, then that needs to be looked at. That needs to, you know, they need to be punished appropriately. But if the person that's talking about it hasn't done it, then we have to talk to them and see if we can find some common ground. Because eventually, when all is said and done, there's gonna be a lot of healing that needs to take place. And it's not just gonna be healing in the United States, it's gonna be healing in the world. Because as we all know, when I'm taping this, this is beginning of February. When I'm taping this, there's a lot of stuff that's coming out, and the world is looking and the world is appalled. And we're gonna have to get to a point eventually where we talk and we work through this, and the people that need to go to jail will go to jail, and we all need to heal and find a better way to make a better world so we're not so dependent on what other people want for us, but as a community, as a whole, coming together and really making a difference in the world and in everybody's life. And sometimes that start can happen with kids. And I mean that in a positive way, not the disgusting way that has come up recently. Because as Whitney once said, children are our future. And they are. Because eventually we all pass away. And so that's up to the next generation to keep going. And then the next generation. But how can how can we have hope for a next generation when everything feels hopeless? And the only way we can do that is if we keep going and we learn to find common ground and we learn to talk and we learn to look past the labels and look at the person's heart. Because sometimes maybe they're misguided with information that is not true. But if we look at who they are in their heart and soul, then maybe we can find some commonality. Because just like I said, I walked into that cancer center or that class and I found common ground. And there was an older gentleman there, and we were supposed to talk a little bit about ourselves. And the teacher said to him, If you can't, you know, he said she said it to all of us, if you can't say anything more than your name, that's okay. And so this older gentleman, he's gotta be in his 70s, I feel, says his name. And he's like, it's just too hard, and he broke down. And the the teacher and the instructor was supportive. And then we all continued on eventually. But the thing is, there was raw emotion for most of us in that group. Whether it be joy that we found a community, or allowing us to talk about our our situation and talk about the losses that we suffered from it. Because it it is a process and it is something that when we we don't really examine, and it's kind of like what Margaret was saying that we avoid the tough questions, and when we avoid those tough questions, the thing is about that, it's like somebody telling you you have cancer, one of your friends, and or somebody somebody passed away, and you know what to do when somebody passed away, you're gonna be there right away, but eventually you move on. Eventually the the people around you start focusing on their life, they quit checking in on you. And with cancer, well, people pull away because yes, there's some that are gonna be supportive because this may be the last time you're gonna be there, but then there's the other people that look at people and say, I can't deal with this. I can't watch you die, I can't watch you get sick. And my sister-in-law did that when my husband was in the hospital those last couple of days. I said, Do you want to come see him? No, I I don't want to see I don't want to have that memory of him. But it's still a memory. It's still a little bit of time. And so back to what I was saying, sometimes we all just need to try to figure that common ground out so we can embrace life and make a better place in the world instead of living in fear because fear is toxic. So on that note, I hope you check Margaret's book out. I have links in the show notes, and you know, just keep going and try to make the best of your day every day. And take care of you, take care of your loved ones, and just just keep going because it's important. So, on that note, I like to thank Fast Susie for the intro and outro music, Margaret for coming on and talking about her book and her life, and you guys. I thank you so very much for tuning in, whether it be morning, noon, or night. I so greatly appreciate it. And I'll catch you next time, guys. Bye.